.44-77 PP bullets.

[Distant Thunder]

Now, Arnie, you go and make it even more difficult to not get carried away with buying .44 caliber molds! I don't even have a .44 caliber rifle and I've already got at least four .44 caliber molds!

I really like the ogive length you are putting on these bullets. As I said before, shortening the nose and lengthening the shank will improve some of the problems I had with the prolate design as Brent first designed it. Those early prolate that he and I worked with where the nose was 50% of the OAL were very light and may have had some issues caused by the long nose in the transonic zone.

I will ultimately have at least two 2-D PPB for my .44-77, one of your design and one other of a design to be determined.

One of the unique things about the .44-77 is that some of the brass I have "come up with" is heavy enough in the necks that when combined with Shiloh's excellent tight standard GG chamber accepts a straight sided bore diameter PPB just about perfectly with no neck sizing. In part because it is formed from longer brass which causes the necks to heavier. I have no idea how everything will play out but it's going to be interesting for sure.

[Distant Thunder]

Don,

Both of Arnie's bullets are designed for faster twists than Shiloh's 19. A similar design of the correct length (1.325" max.) for a 19 would work very well.

[Don McDowell]

1.32 might work, but that was the really neat part about that nose pour adjustable mould I could piddle with the length until the length would hold decent vertical at 1000 no matter the crosswinds. lordy did I ever go thru primers and powder trying to get the thing sorted out for long range shooting. Took some pretty bad butt whooping at some matches as well. LOL
I haven't messed much with bullets longer than the 434470 in the 17 twist, as it comes out at 1.37 and even from 16-1 the sort weight I use is 471 grains.
I've also found that with the Shiloh chamber resizing the cases is not particularly necessary once you find the right bullet diameter and paper.

[Distant Thunder]

We'll talk more when I have my rifle. It should keep me busy and out trouble for a good long time! It's just too bad things couldn't have timed out a little better, I could be working with here at home while this damn virus has everything shut down. Never said I had any good luck!

That's the reason I bought this .44 caliber BACO adjustable mold. I figured I could play with the length and see what that barrel is going to like best. I did the same thing with .40-65 and that worked out very well. I plan to build on what I learned with the .40-65 and have a fine shootin' rifle in this .44-77.

[Don McDowell]

One more little trick you might find handy with the 44 cases. The lee case trimmer length gauge for the 444 marlin works right well to trim any cases that grow a little bit on you.
I'm looking forward to seeing what you can make that 44 do when you get it.

[beltfed]

Don.
The first bullet is for the 17 twist as in Jim's Krieger barrel which is a 0.438 bore and 0.446 groove : the body is 0.431 to patch to 0.437-0.438"
The base at 0.439 patches up to the FF case neck I.D. and 0.446 groove.

The second bullet is for 18, NOT 19 twist. and Matt's 44-100 Badger barrel is larger bore and groove at 0.440 bore and 0.449 groove.
so, for that barrel, we set the body at o.433 and the base band to 0.443 to patch to the FF case neck I.D. and groove.
Matt has some thicker paper-I think the 9# onion skin
from Baco that he wants to use.
Arnie

[Don McDowell]

The 17 twist barrels make life much simpler for coming up with a consistent long range preformer.
I like the .432 diameter at the base of the nose for the dual diameter bullets. That's what both of the blocks I have are, and they work very well.

[beltfed]

From what all you guys are describing, I agree that a 17 twist would be the way to go for a 44.
That rifle Matt S is working for is a rebuilt, rebarrelled original Hepburn action and a Badger barrel
that goes way back to the Ernie Stallman days. And so, it is an 18 twist just like a 45 cal.

One of the things that BACO will do is to adjust the diameters on a design in their catalog to suit a customer's desire.
Dave explained that Jim can easily do such changes on in programming. For Other changes- lengths, ogives become "new" designs.
Arnie

[Don McDowell]

I think the 17 twist is about as good as it gets. Altho that 18 twist in Matt's gun will likely do well. The 19 twist Shiloh uses works real well, but when going headlong into long range accuracy the bullet length gets really critical
Not sure there's any "bad" 44 twists. LOL.

[Distant Thunder]

So just how deep are you other .44-77 shooters seating your bore diameter paper patch bullets into the case. Some of the original cartridges had them seat fairly deep, .200 deep is one .44-77 I've seen and in a .44-90 SBN the bullet was seated .500 deep.

Obviously the wad(s) and bullet base have to above the shoulder neck junction, but there i still a good amount of neck to work with.