rifle detonation again

[Lumpy Grits]

I thank all for their responses to my post. Does anyone know the load in detail that was used in this incident. I would like to know if the bullet was seated to the lands or back to say a standard overall length.

It was the action that let loose-Nut'n to due with where the bullet start'd.......
Here's a start-
http://www.assra.com/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.p...1340046856

LG

No Lumpy the barrel ruptured in this case,

Go back to post #15

Your 'rite'-Thought this was the other one
Gary

[Kurt]

Gary they both were bad. Those two shooters are still looking down on the grass and not looking up at the roots.
The larger the powder capacity in the case the more likely this will happen.

[alfajim]

I thank all for their responses to my post. Does anyone know the load in detail that was used in this incident. I would like to know if the bullet was seated to the lands or back to say a standard overall length.

It was the action that let loose-Nut'n to due with where the bullet start'd.......
Here's a start-
http://www.assra.com/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.p...1340046856

LG

Hi ya'all I am new here have done some posting on the what powder thread and started one 45-70 trapdoor.
Wheni decided to build a trapdoor for fum shooting and not use the heirloom collector one I already had I started browsing a number of forums about reloadin, ammo etc. found one site mostly dedicated to trapdoors and shooting them and one member there was saying he used 30-32grs of 5744 with a toilet paper wad tamped down on the powder to hold it to the primer with the .500gr boolit inserted all grooves and lands in the case no crimp. He didn't say if there is an air gap or where.
A larger number of posters were swaying in capitol letters DON'T USE SMOKELESS POWDER IN TRAPDOORS EVER. This warning was based on the diff in pressure rise and rise timing between smokeless and BP. What say you?
After reading through this tread and recalling reading on BPCR that the Q has banned the use of wads with duplex smokeless I suspect this blow up is the reason why?

No Lumpy the barrel ruptured in this case,

Go back to post #15

Your 'rite'-Thought this was the other one
Gary

[Robert L]

Gentlemen,

I'm not a big poster here and will admit up front that I am unfamiliar with some of the shoots that are held, especially out west, but; I have read most of the posts to this thread and something that puzzles me is the fact that duplex loads or smokeless loads are in any way necessary to maintain attendance to these shoots.

Whoever makes the rules runs the show. If the rules say NO Smokeless then that's the way it is and should be. If the shooters want to shoot then they will need to abide by the rules. Obviously, if attendance drops then they really didn't want to compete anyway or they thought they had a leg up on other shooters with the use of smokeless and without it they are at a disadvantage. Seems to me if everyone shoots by the same rules no one has an advantage except in personal shooting skills.

[Lumpy Grits]

Is there any update on the injured shooter?
Gary

[Fogman01]

Gentlemen,

I'm not a big poster here and will admit up front that I am unfamiliar with some of the shoots that are held, especially out west, but; I have read most of the posts to this thread and something that puzzles me is the fact that duplex loads or smokeless loads are in any way necessary to maintain attendance to these shoots.

Whoever makes the rules runs the show. If the rules say NO Smokeless then that's the way it is and should be. If the shooters want to shoot then they will need to abide by the rules. Obviously, if attendance drops then they really didn't want to compete anyway or they thought they had a leg up on other shooters with the use of smokeless and without it they are at a disadvantage. Seems to me if everyone shoots by the same rules no one has an advantage except in personal shooting skills.

Agree 100%. I have no desire to sit next to some moron who loads smokeless in BPCRs. What is the point anyway? In my case it is the opposite - I won't shoot in a match that is not Black Powder only. The reason was posted with pictures in this thread.

[Fogman01]

This is a cut and paste from the Pedersoli owner's manual for the 1874 Sharps. Even the manufacturer doesn't recommend reloading with smokeless. Don't understand why black powder guns can't be enjoyed for what they are: BLACK POWDER guns.

LOADING AND FIRING
1a) Use only factory loaded ammunition, C.I.P ruled or reload with black powder (or Pyrodex, if
allowed in your Country), in the gun’s caliber.
The .45-70 caliber can be loaded with commercial smokeless factory made ammunition, not
exceeding the 29.007 C.U.P. / P.S.I. or reloaded cartridges with black powder (or Pyrodex, if
allowed in your Country) not exceeding the 25.000 C.U.P./P.S.I.

[Lumpy Grits]

I'm only interested the injured shooters condition is all.
Gary

[Semtav]

Agree 100%. I have no desire to sit next to some moron who loads smokeless in BPCRs. What is the point anyway? In my case it is the opposite - I won't shoot in a match that is not Black Powder only. The reason was posted with pictures in this thread.

Altho I respect your right to that set of standards, It also makes me wonder. I regularly shoot at a military rifle match where I load 15 - 19 grains of 4227 in my load. altho these rifles were designed for smokeless, I could easily double or triple charge a load and have the same results. Am I a moron ? I also on occasion shoot lever action silhouette matches where I also have the capability of double charging a load. same question. What about these scheutzen matches where they are predominately shooting smokeless in older guns. Are they all morons? I would be more worried about what condition the rifle of the person sitting next to me was in rather that if they are shooting smokeless or BP. I guarantee you I could very easily blow up a bpcr with black powder.

[Fogman01]

"Am I a moron ?"
I think you know what a BPCR is. I think you know what I am talking about - rifles designed for BP and built before the advent of smokeless powder and modern replicas whose manufacturers specifically caution against smokeless powder being used in them. Shiloh Sharps being one of those manufacturers in most of their calibers. Of course there are many smokeless cartridges whose volume will allow them to be seriously over charged - you can double the maximum smokeless charge by using Bullseye in a 9mm or .45 ACP case. Of course a person who uses the correct amount is not a moron; he is doing what the gun and cartridge is designed for... but someone who ignores the recommended loads (and powder) and goes to a range around other shooters to pop off his "pet" (read potentially dangerous) load is a moron. I read blog where the guy was bragging about his .44 magnum P+++++ loads that were way hotter than a .454 Casull. Want to shoot next to him? My point is why call it a BPCR match if smokeless is allowed? Why load smokeless in a rifle that was not designed to operate with it? Why can't a BPCR match be just that? If you want to shoot smokeless do it from a rifle that was designed to operate with it and do it in a smokeless match. After reading in several blogs the "justifications" for loading smokeless in BP rifles, I have to think that a lot of those who do that are just too dang lazy to clean their rifle.