Kurt, that picture of those recovered bullets you have showing some paper caught on the base and the fold still in the hollow.
Do you suppose that part of that may of been from the hollow base actually pinching /trapping the paper?.
Could this maybe have been prevented by not completely closing the paper in to the center of the bullet?

Have you found any solid base bullets showing the same problem?

Just questions that popped up after seeing that picture.
Great big thanks to you for sharing those with everyone.

(02-20-2014, 12:58 PM)Don McDowell Wrote: Kurt, that picture of those recovered bullets you have showing some paper caught on the base and the fold still in the hollow.
Do you suppose that part of that may of been from the hollow base actually pinching /trapping the paper?.
Could this maybe have been prevented by not completely closing the paper in to the center of the bullet?

Have you found any solid base bullets showing the same problem?

Just questions that popped up after seeing that picture.
Great big thanks to you for sharing those with everyone.

Don.

Those bullets are from Rick Mulhern he sent me to see what was going on because the trouble he was having with them. I used that photo because it was in the bucket files.
After I picked those up when the snow melted I did a bunch the next winter to further look into this because I had the same thought like you mentioned so I shot a bunch (130) the following winter with the cup based and flat based bullets folded under like the Hyde and twisted or just folded covering the base. I found more with the cup base than the flat base but it made no difference if they were like the Hyde or completely covering the cup or flat base. I found paper in betted in the shank like you saw in the photo. It was always with a wet bore.
When I shot Ricks bullets I thought it was the deep cup with a thin skirt that pushed the under bore diameter bullet forward causing this and to this day I still think that what happen in this case because those particular bullets had a .49237" diameter and a .082 deep thin skirt cupped base.

Very interesting Kurt. I really do appreciate the amount of experimenting you have done over the years and am grateful that you see fit to share it with us.
I'm betting that those with the paper embedded in the base, also don't always strike the target where they should have.
Also do you know if those rounds left paper rings?

Don those bullets did not go through a target. But yes I have found paper on the targets not the rings.

The bullets of Ricks I did shoot at the target some did no make contact on the backer @ 130 yards. Those 4 went into the snow before they hit the target.

Don, Kurt, where are the pic's posted?

Tim

(02-20-2014, 07:13 PM)Tombstone 71 Wrote: Don, Kurt, where are the pic's posted?

Tim

Right here

Wow. The paper on the shank near the base reminds me of crumpled cases I've seen that have been fired when breech seating with smokeless. The pressure builds up before the case seals the chamber and gets between the case and chamber and crumples it. Maybe something similar happens with the sides of the bullet in the cupped area. Mind you that probably doesn't explain that you've only seen it with wet bores.

Chris.