45-70 Trapdoor

[Caprock]

Cone/relieve the affected areas like the did the old muzzle loaders for ease of loading. Pretty sure you don't need that for a td but it would cure your problem.

[alfajim]

The issue rifles had a 3 groove 1:22 twist. The chambers were cut a touch long so they could be fired dirty in combat. You can do what I did with my rolling block, take a 45-90 case and trim it a little at a time until it chambers my rolling block has a Springfield chamber and will take 2.2" case. The 500gr Gov bullet shoots great in the slow twist I use it out to 500 regularly with good results. Both Lyman and SEACO make a copy of it. Try the stock front sight out for awhile. I have fired a few trap doors with the buffington sight and the original front sight. It is an accurate combination capable of very good accuracy out to 500 and beyond.

I like the idea of maybe using 45-90 cases to work up a round with a little more umpf to shoot longer ranges for doing some shooting at a match or two. So I'll get a few to try that my question is if the rim dia. and thickness is the same as the 45-70 gov. so the TD extractor will throw it out and also headspace? The pictures of the 45-90 cases looks like there is a groove in front of the rim whereas on the 45-70 gov. is straight no groove is that a problem?

Jim
Fly Navy

[Nuclearcricket]

Jim, that grove you see is just part of the manufacturing process, everyone does things a little differently. The 45 cases from the 70 to the 120 all have the same rim diameter and the same case head diameter, just the lengths are different. Your extractor should do about the same with the 90 case as it will do with the 70 case. The aerodynamics might be slightly different due to the different lengths but that's all.
Sam

[alfajim]

Jim, that grove you see is just part of the manufacturing process, everyone does things a little differently. The 45 cases from the 70 to the 120 all have the same rim diameter and the same case head diameter, just the lengths are different. Your extractor should do about the same with the 90 case as it will do with the 70 case. The aerodynamics might be slightly different due to the different lengths but that's all.
Sam

Thanks Sam appreciate the info on the cases so after I get comfortable with the gun and the 70 cases with loading and shooting I can step it up a little.
I have no plans to graduate up to the level of most folks here with the modern custom versions and shooting at a lot of matches as I am just starting out and I am as old or older than most all doing this for awhile.I will just stick with the TD work it up and have fun and a match or two as being in Ca. a lot of traveling involved to expand.
I think I saw some mention of a TD class in some of the BPCR shoots that would be nice so not competing with the better guns.
Maybe think about doing the Q in the future.

Jim

[alfajim]

Just had a thought so I'm asking if any of you fine folks are still shooting the trapdoor still in matches or have they become to much of a collectors item?
As best as I can tell from my own research there are still a lot of them around and quite a few that are in just shooting shape.
Any pointers from those still using them would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks guys
Jim

[JReed]

The 45-70 and 45-90 share the same rim diam so no issues there. Go slow on the trimming testing fit as you go when done you will have custom fit brass. The extra powder capacity is a function of being able to seat the bullet out farther due to the long chamber. With my custom trim brass my COAL is the same as my 2.1" brass I just have more bullet in the case with the longer brass. I can get more powder in a case than a gun with a SAMMI chamber regardless of the case used. If you reline you will end up with a chamber of modern spec.

[Brownie Nash]

Jim

I am in Central Oregon and at the COSSA range here we shoot out to 1200 yds. and a midrange match to 700 yds. Several of us use trapdoors, and some of us do okay.

Brownie

[alfajim]

A little updating here I now have 150 rounds of new brass 50 starline and 100 WW. Got 50 of the .458 - 405 HB bullits from BACO to use at first. They are 20-1 and pre lubed. I do have the Lee 405 Spence mold to cast them later in 30-1 if I find it necessary if the 20-1's don't seal well, in accurate!

Still need primers and powder. I am going to use large rifle primers just haven't decided on CCI or Winchester reading the reviews on CCI on Midway it is about 50 50 on reliability much better for Winchester any recommendations? I know a lot of you use CCI BR2 primers but right now they are out of the budget cost wise almost double the others.

Will use OE for powder after reading all the good reviews here. Am going to pick up 5lbs from BACO 4 of 2f and one 3f to try workups with the 500 0r 520 bullets for shooting out to a 1000. Most likely will get a box of the 1881 500 gr gov from BACO later to try at first.

By the way for all you trapdoor/buffington sight users Track of the Wolf now have the micrometer sight adjuster in stock I think it is $140.

[JReed]

I use Winchester simply because that is what the local guys carry.

[alfajim]

The closest to me local gun shop carries the Winchester WLR primers for $4.00 a 100 which beats the hell out of having to buy 1000 @ $31.00 plus hazmat and shipping. The total from Brownells was $75.00 only a little less from Midway.
The gun shop is only 20 min drive.
Have ordered 5 lbs old e from BACO 4 of 2f and one 3f @ $19.50 a pound plus haz and shipping by Fedex ground have in about a week. Also got 50 405 HB bullets pre sized and lubed w/SPG from them to use at first so now have all ammo stuff plus reloading stuff.
Will finish putting together the collector rifle back to shooting condition next few days and make some reloads to try at the range just to get a feel.
Don't have a blow tube but do have a cleaning rod w/guide, patches, bore cleaner and some ox lobed patches so will just wipe for now for fouling control.

Jim