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44-60 bottle neck
06-28-2019, 08:55 PM
Post: #11
RE: 44-60 bottle neck
FWIW

Starline is now making 348 Win brass. It's pricey at $430 for 250 pieces.
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07-09-2019, 06:38 PM
Post: #12
RE: 44-60 bottle neck
(06-27-2019 01:53 PM)Don McDowell Wrote:  Sam I wonder if you could scare up some 50-110 cases. Those were the ones that Winchester based the 348 off of in the first place, but I think they drew them a little heavier to handle the higher pressures of smokeless.
Maybe if you could find some of the Hornady 348 cases those might hold a bit more powder. I know the 45-70 cases I have from them hold way more powder than rp or ww.

Keep us posted on that Hepburn project, I've heard those "kits" need a lot of work.

Don I sent an inquiry to BACO and all I got as a response was that they have always used 348 brass. However I did send some questions off to Starline and got a lot more information back from them. The 110 brass uses a different taper mandrel to form the inside of the case so that it would be thinner as you go up the length of the case. So that would probably add a bit to case volume. They also told me that the 50 Alaskan case would be a better choice to use to form the 44-60 from as its only a 2.1" case so you would have less trimming and waste. The rim and head size are the same.
I will give BACO a few more days to get back to me on my last question and then I will pose this one to them to see if they can for the 60 case from the Alaskan brass. The only drawback, so to speak, that I could for see is that the Alaskan brass might need to be annealed before you do much to it. Also the Starline Alaska brass is a lot cheaper than the 458 cases are. So perhaps the savings on the brass cost would offset the cost of annealing it. Time will tell I guess.
Sam
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07-09-2019, 08:11 PM
Post: #13
RE: 44-60 bottle neck
That 50 alaskan sounds like it may be the ticket if the rim size is close.

A wise man can always be found alone. A weak man can always be found in a crowd.
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07-10-2019, 05:44 AM
Post: #14
RE: 44-60 bottle neck
I did ask that question also and the head and rim are the same for the Alaskan, 110 and 348. I will send off an Email to BACO and see if they will grab a case and see how reforming it goes comapired to a 348 case. If it works, and they do case forming to order it may be a win win all around. Some cost savings and labor savings for both BACO and the customer.
Sam
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07-10-2019, 06:45 PM
Post: #15
RE: 44-60 bottle neck
Sounds like a plan coming together.

A wise man can always be found alone. A weak man can always be found in a crowd.
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07-11-2019, 09:23 AM
Post: #16
RE: 44-60 bottle neck
I did hear back from BACO. I was told that I could purchase a few cases. I will do that next week after Payday. Ya'll know how things get a bit tight at the end of the cycle. I think it will be interesting to see what and if there is much difference between using the WW 348 case and the Starline Alaskan case.
Once I get them I will make some measurements and take come weights and check the volume and let you all know what spills out. My thinking is the Alaskan case will have a bit more volume and a thinner neck but at this point its only a guess.
Sam
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07-11-2019, 04:34 PM
Post: #17
RE: 44-60 bottle neck
Sam will this chamber be for PP or both greasers and PP. Could you also figure out if it holds more or less than a 44-70. I have brass that I could fill with water and check.
Very interested in this project.
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07-11-2019, 06:36 PM
Post: #18
RE: 44-60 bottle neck
My plan is to make this a PP chamber. Sadly it is something that will take me a while to complete and I am at this point gathering information and such. I have a barrel and an action I am working on very slowly.
As to the total case capicity, my reformed 348 case holds about 15 grains less powder than a 45-70 case. Useable powder space on the reformed case is about 42 grains of 1.5 swiss. That is why I am invistagating using another case for the base case to see if maybe I can pick up a litttle more capacity and also get a bit of a thinner neck.
PT&G as supposed to send me some prints to look at and do some figuring on but they have not sent them yet and I will have to give them a call next week. I will also be ordering a case or 2 from BACO formed from the 50 Alaskan brass. If that works out that might be what I use as my base case. Especially if it has a thinner neck. The 348 case I have has a neck thickness of about .0125", and it has a taper on the inside.
From talking to Dave at PT&G I did get the impression that there are some people using this round with bp and using it quite well. I just do not remember the names of the people he mentioned.
There doesn't seem to be much information out there about the history of the round but it did exist at some point in history and I guess I am kind of a sucker for oddballs. If you figure that BN cases are actually good, and the .44 is good, and the .44BN is good, then what is wrong with a small .44 bn?
And if it don't work out, it can alway be turned into a 44-77 with a PP chamber. I all ready have on with a greaser chamber.
With it being a PP chamber, I figure I don't need to have dies for it. The most it would need would to be neck sized and I just did a drawing up this morning for a bushing die that should work. Its just a shorter version of the die I all ready use and I can swap some of the components back and forth. The right sized bushing will have to be figured out at a later date. The longer die I only have available as a PDF and I can easily convert the short one to PDF is anyone wants one. The longer die will also work on cases as short as 2.1" for either 40-65 or 45-70. I am not posative but do think my die will work with other commercially available neck size bushings. And if not I am sure the die could be modified to fit them with out much problem. I do have a bit of an upper hand in this area as I am a machinist and have a lathe and mill. Both of them are small but they will eventually get the job done.
Sam
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